2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

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steveloomis
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#301 Post by steveloomis » Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:15 am

I am in that process right now. I've had the R1 speedo/tach since last summer but have not hooked up the speedo yet. I have a speedohealer and am in the process of calibrating it. I am pretty close at 78.0% Positive setting, still a mile per hour or so low, then the speedo went to 0 mph. When I got home, not far, I pulled the cover and found the plastic sensor mounting had broken and ruined the sensor. I think it was due to vibration. This is one I purchased from Digikey. It was working great at 1/8" spacing or a bit more. The one listed in this thread had wires attached, the one I received from Digikey had a socket with pins. No problem I cut the socket down to allow closer access to the pins for soldering wire to, then filled it in with silicone. Nice package. This sensor is larger by quite a bit over the R1 sensor. Looks about like R1 sensor only about 1/2 the size. Since I have a couple R1 sensors, I am going to adapt them to my aluminum bracket. Seems like the R1 sensor is not quite as sensitive as the Cherry one from Digikey. The speedohealer has a test mode and while in the test mode it will generate a test MPH to drive your clock, repeated pressings of the "set" button increases the speedo test mph. Last setting I was running at 183mph!!!! Humm, probably the fastest this bike will every see. Anyway, while in the test mode, you can rotate your rear wheel/countershaft sprocket and the "t" on the speedohealer readout will flash to indicate it is sensing the motion. With the Cherry sensor from Digikey, I could wiggle a small screwdriver between the sprocket teeth and trigger the test reading. Not so with the the R1 sensor. I had to get really close to the face of it with the screwdriver to trigger. This just means the sensor will have to be close to the sprocket and probably centered pretty well.

I would like to see what others have used to mount the sensor. I used a flat aluminum piece about 1/8" thick and 3/4" wide. I fitted it over the shifter shaft then cut out the bottom of it so I could remove it without sliding it off the shaft. The chain and sprocket get in the way and since I am using a 530 chain on my LC (they came with that size) I have do deal with a large stiff chain. Anyway I extended it upwards and to the rear behind the sprocket, bent an L shape to fit just under the upper lip of the engine case, moved it inwards so it is not extending past the edge of the engine case overhang and put a small 5mm hex bolt thru the case lip using a fender washer on top for added strength. It fits very solid and can be removed with out messing with the chain and sprocket.

Now that the Cherry sensor is damaged and no longer triggers the speedohealer, I'll have to modify my sensor mounting just a bit to accomodate the R1 sensor. When I get it remounted, I'll post a picture of it.
Last edited by steveloomis on Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:24 am, edited 3 times in total.
'81 RD350LC hybrid w/84 RZ engine. Zeel, Old style Toomeys, Yboot and filter 420 main 22.5 pilot, Air screw 2.5 turns out, DJ needle 2nd from top, Canadian VM26 carbs.
'85 KR/RZ US. Tank is seeping causing a blister in paint.....

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nikfubar
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#302 Post by nikfubar » Sun Mar 31, 2013 7:40 am

There ya go, here's how I mounted my R1 sensor, fabricated a bracket to go in behind the side cover, the two screws holding it in place are removed & then it's held in place by the cover screws.

Image

Tested mine with a drill :smt003 then out on the road used a sat nav to give actual speed against indicated, then adjusted the speed healer & it reads perfect now.

Image
Image

Running on 3

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steveloomis
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#303 Post by steveloomis » Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:21 am

How much gap did you use. Looks like an R1 sensor you are using. Did you have to fiddle with it or was it reading the sprocket without problems?
'81 RD350LC hybrid w/84 RZ engine. Zeel, Old style Toomeys, Yboot and filter 420 main 22.5 pilot, Air screw 2.5 turns out, DJ needle 2nd from top, Canadian VM26 carbs.
'85 KR/RZ US. Tank is seeping causing a blister in paint.....

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nikfubar
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#304 Post by nikfubar » Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:48 am

I left a 3mm gap, yes it's the R1 sensor & it worked first time, no fiddling :smt023
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Running on 3

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JonW
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#305 Post by JonW » Sun Mar 31, 2013 7:40 pm

I so need to fit my one of these... hmm...

thanks for the continued updates guys!
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
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steveloomis
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#306 Post by steveloomis » Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:19 pm

I will post a pic of mine soon as soon as I remount the R1 sensor in place of the broken Cherry Sensor.

I went back to the start of this thread and see Smurph's bracket.

Notice the size of the Cherry Sensor, much larger than the R1. Mounting the R1 sensor is difficult due to small size and very small clearance for bolt. Cherry much larger and easier to mount.
Image

I copied his somewhat. Instead of the top mounting going over the top of the engine case, I recessed it, bent an L shape in it and put a small bolt thru the engine case lip into the bracket. This recessed it below the engine case. With my 530 chain, I needed all the clearance I could get. I also used the shifter shaft as above but let the hole open toward the bottom so I could remove it without removing the sprocket and chain.

I also did not put the adjustment slot. Instead you can rotate the bracket up and down as well as move the sensor side to side for alignment purposes. Also, you have to cut the nylon spacer the thickness of the aluminum bracket to maintain correct spacer dimensions.

Smurph used the Cherry sensor from Digikey. I ordered the exact same one, but it came with a socket and pins with no pigtail.

Here is my current installation. Gap is about 1/8". Speedo operation is very smooth. Currently my speedo healer setting is P0083.8, which is +83.8% speedup and is very close now. I am running a 16 39 sprocket combo and stock tires on my LC.
530 chain is NOT rubbing at the top but is hitting the bottom side a little. Minimal wear I'd say. Have to watch it though.

Image

Top mounting, a little blurry but you can see the fender washer sandwiching with the bracket. Should not break engine case.
Image

bottom mounting
Image

Closeup of R1 Sensor about 1/8" from teeth is perfect, no fiddling needed.

Image

Thank you Smurph for your work and inspiration. I really like the R1 speedo/tach/temp readout.
'81 RD350LC hybrid w/84 RZ engine. Zeel, Old style Toomeys, Yboot and filter 420 main 22.5 pilot, Air screw 2.5 turns out, DJ needle 2nd from top, Canadian VM26 carbs.
'85 KR/RZ US. Tank is seeping causing a blister in paint.....

Desmodue
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#307 Post by Desmodue » Mon May 13, 2013 2:59 pm

Can this instrument cluster activate the cooling fan. I see that a wire was marked by SMurph as Cooling Fan Relay, and wondered if anyone has looked at this. Adding a R6 fan to mine this weekend and would be interested in having it automagically turning on, but not $40-$70 worth...

Thanks,
Rod
Rod

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steveloomis
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#308 Post by steveloomis » Mon May 13, 2013 3:11 pm

I saw that too. I suspect it will pull to ground when the fan is to run. Wire a relay with +12V on the coil and this wire on the other coil connection. Put sensor in a pan of very hot water or just idle 'til it gets hot and see what happens. Let us know how this works out. It may source +12volts when cooling is needed and if so, ground one side of the coil and the sourced wire to the other side of the coil. Will work one way or the other. A small Bosch relay will do the trick.

Please let us know how this works out if you decide to try it. It would be very nice and simple.
'81 RD350LC hybrid w/84 RZ engine. Zeel, Old style Toomeys, Yboot and filter 420 main 22.5 pilot, Air screw 2.5 turns out, DJ needle 2nd from top, Canadian VM26 carbs.
'85 KR/RZ US. Tank is seeping causing a blister in paint.....

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JonW
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#309 Post by JonW » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:55 pm

I'd like to think the relay wire worked like that, would be cool and I've been wracking my brains about what temp the 2001 R1 fans came on, but I reckon its a moot point as I was sure the logic for the fans came from the temp switch, not the dash. Tho I could be wrong... and hope I am. Did anyone test this?
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#310 Post by JonW » Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:07 pm

The world has moved on a bit... we all know that... but GPS speedos are here now for cars and ATVs with some useful kit coming onto the market and Im sure a lot more to come. So, I've been researching a GPS sender for the R1 dash rather than using the R1/Cherry senders through a speedo healer. Cost is about the same and of course there are pros and cons...

Pros
----
Easier to wire - less parts so less things to fit and potentially less drain on the battery
Easier to calibrate, no need to recalibrate for tyres, C&S combos etc - see link below
Less electrical parts/wiring to go wrong
No chance of fouling the chain and sprockets or gear change shaft

Cons
----
Tunnels and highrise buildings can mar/kill the signals, especially in places of low Sat activity like Australia LOL
Satellite acquisition time = no speedo readings until its triangulated
Weatherproofing and vibration on motorcycles for in car units where sealing is an issue.

The best that Ive found so far is this one:

http://www.c-a-i.net/Sky_Drive.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Its got a great simple calibration (push button, let go at 50mph/80kph, then adjust with small presses to get it right, job done!) and made by a company that does industrial electronics in the usa, but the distribution seems patchy. Most of the others I found are outputting aftermarket car pulse requirements (usually listed as 4000, 8000, 16000 per mile), which work well with the aftermarket dashes, but are not generic like the above, which works for all units.

What the Skydrive doesnt say on the site is what it's rate of 'speed pulse send' is... Most other mfrs seem to state that 10hz is very fast and what their product has.

Anyone else done any work on driving these units by GPS and want to share? Id like the speedo healer guys to come out with their version really, they know bikes and so you can be sure the unit will survive in our environment.
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

Like Watches? www.PloProf.com & www.DeskDivers.com

RuZty
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#311 Post by RuZty » Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:04 am

Jon, quite interesting, and Canadian too! Image
Did you get a price on this?

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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#312 Post by JonW » Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:34 am

haha, I actually didnt notice that!

Price seems to be about $240-250 on most sites, up to 259 on ebay, but I reckon with a bit if research and maybe a few of us bandying togther we might get it cheaper?
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

Like Watches? www.PloProf.com & www.DeskDivers.com

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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#313 Post by JonW » Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:59 pm

FYI, for those looking for info on how the RZ oil sender works, check here: http://www.rzrd500.com/phpBB3/viewtopic ... 21&t=10677" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

Like Watches? www.PloProf.com & www.DeskDivers.com

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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO

#314 Post by JonW » Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:54 pm

JonW wrote:I'd like to think the relay wire worked like that, would be cool and I've been wracking my brains about what temp the 2001 R1 fans came on, but I reckon its a moot point as I was sure the logic for the fans came from the temp switch, not the dash. Tho I could be wrong... and hope I am. Did anyone test this?
Rereading this thread again in its entirety as I'm hoping to do this work soon, I saw that earlier Smuph suggested the fans are controlled by the dash in the 2000/2001 models. After all that makses sense as that year R1 has only one temp sender, unlike the previous years. So I started to think he is probably right... well, c'mon, he has a good hit rate! :smt023

Anyway, I did some digging for completeness... about the on / off temps since I mentioned them. The R1 fans are said to come on at 220F and off at 208F, some people on the R1 forums say their fans come on at 212 and some say 214. This make me think that either they are not seeing the values right, or that the logic is controlled elsewhere, as if the gauge did it then the software would be exact and the same each time and installation as it would read the value from the temp sender and go from there, unless it has other parameters as well, ie bike is stopped etc?

Anyway a moot point as these values are a bit high for head temps for our 2 strokes perhaps?

220F = 104C
208F = 97.8C
212F = 100C

Interestingly the Hayden 3561 adjustable fan controller is switchable for 'on' between 160F and 210F.

So useful or not perhaps we need to test the output of the wire from the cluster I guess. If its enegerised when the temp sender is above the 'on' value then we know how it works and the logic is in the dash.
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

Like Watches? www.PloProf.com & www.DeskDivers.com

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Re:

#315 Post by JonW » Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:57 pm

nikfubar wrote:
RuZty wrote:Current Speedohealer v4 is -100% to +1000%. That is what I am using, got one in the garage. Hoping to get this done over the winter.
I have just bought the same speedohealer & the R1 connection loom to go with it & I'm confused.
When I temporary wired it Orange/red = power, Black/white = earth & Pink = speedo input it worked ( refer to wiring diagram on this thread )
The loom which they sent me marked for R1 among others it has the power to the Pink & speedo input to the Orange/red WTF anyone any ideas, don't want to blow it up :smt017
nikfubar wrote:Yup that's the one :smt002 got mine all sorted now with the speed healer.
Nik, what was the issue with your wiring in the end here and how did it get fixed?
80 XT500 Supermoto!
81 RD350LC Resto
82 RD421LC Hybrid
82 RD350LC decapitation project
82 RD250LC JDM '251LC' YPVS
83 RZ350 Resto
84 RZ500 Resto
85 RZ350 F1 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Resto
86 RZ350 F2 Hybrid

Like Watches? www.PloProf.com & www.DeskDivers.com

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