2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Moderator: rztom
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Really interesting on the power feed, I handt considered that...
The tach stuff you mention was much the same when I plumbed in the EGTs on my 421. The LC tacho and the EGT digital tacho dont match. Its not 1000 revs out, but its not the same. The old analogue needle drive system sucks as it gets old I reckon...
The low fuel 'count up' was one of the things I really liked about the R1 dash, using it for oil would be supercool.
The tach stuff you mention was much the same when I plumbed in the EGTs on my 421. The LC tacho and the EGT digital tacho dont match. Its not 1000 revs out, but its not the same. The old analogue needle drive system sucks as it gets old I reckon...
The low fuel 'count up' was one of the things I really liked about the R1 dash, using it for oil would be supercool.
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
What does the EGT tach read off? Is it higher than the stock one? I was getting about 20% higher on the R1 tach.JonW wrote: The LC tacho and the EGT digital tacho dont match. Its not 1000 revs out, but its not the same. The old analogue needle drive system sucks as it gets old I reckon...
The low fuel 'count up' was one of the things I really liked about the R1 dash, using it for oil would be supercool.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
In an attempt to get the oil trip odometer working I determined that the R1 fuel sender (actually just a low level switch) consists of a NTC thermistor (resistance decreases as it heats up). It sits in gas and is thus kept cool, with over 1k ohm to keep the light off. Once the level drops and it's in air it gets warmer and the resistance drops below 300 ohm and the light comes on. The cheap one I bought on eBay might have been a bit sketchy, but I learned that if you test them on 12V with no upstream resistor they smell bad in about 5 seconds and then the smoke gets out. I have taken apart an oil sender and rewiring it as just on/off will allow me to use a SPDT relay to switch resistance values, or I might splurge on a new sender from Yamaha.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
nope its not 20%, but its more than the analogue. The EGT is a Koso so reads off the white wires and applies a factor to it, its something crazy so not useful in this instance, plus its a sense not using the wires... a very different setup.
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Okay, I think I am ready to call this a wrap. I desoldered the fuel and oil LED's from the PCB and used a small drill bit (by hand) to enlarge the holes for the oil LED so I could connect it to the fuel LED contacts. The R1 fuel sender is a small vented container with a NTC thermistor in it, as the fuel drops it stops being cooled and its resistance goes down. This drops the voltage from the gauges on the sensor wire from around 10.8 volts to below 8.6, which turns on the light. It works in oil just as well as gas. When I was experimenting with this I had gas in the jar, and after watching the voltage drop to 4.7 volts I stuck it back in the gas and heard a sizzling sound and a puff of vapour came up from the sensor. . At his point I switched to oil.
The sender in the pics is actually from a VTR1000, the same component appears in numerous Japanese senders and is likely supplied to them all by the same supplier. I just need to rig this into a spare RZ oil level sender at a suitable height and it's good to go. You could probably rig something up by wiring extra resistors into the stock sender driving a relay but I thought this was cleaner.
I just need to calculate how far I can go to empty once the light comes on.
LED rewiring;
The oil light glows red about 30 seconds after the sensor is uncovered and it starts the separate trip odometer. I deemed making the LCD read 'O' instead of 'F' to be beyond the scope of this project.
I currently have a Zeel PV controller on the bike and remembered that the programmer has a tach function. I hooked it up along with the R1 tach running off the W/R pickup coil lead and they were very close. They were also about 12% higher than the stock electronic RZ tach when holding a steady throttle. I took it for a ride with the R1 hacked into place and it responded smooth across the range.
I also tried the HEI mod to drive the tach since I had one kicking around but the bike would start and idle but not take any throttle at all with it in place. I checked the wiring several times and it was as per instructions so I tried it without and it worked fine.
Now I just need to get the right connectors and make the whole thing permanent.
Kudos again to smurph for pioneering this in the first place.
The sender in the pics is actually from a VTR1000, the same component appears in numerous Japanese senders and is likely supplied to them all by the same supplier. I just need to rig this into a spare RZ oil level sender at a suitable height and it's good to go. You could probably rig something up by wiring extra resistors into the stock sender driving a relay but I thought this was cleaner.
I just need to calculate how far I can go to empty once the light comes on.
LED rewiring;
The oil light glows red about 30 seconds after the sensor is uncovered and it starts the separate trip odometer. I deemed making the LCD read 'O' instead of 'F' to be beyond the scope of this project.
I currently have a Zeel PV controller on the bike and remembered that the programmer has a tach function. I hooked it up along with the R1 tach running off the W/R pickup coil lead and they were very close. They were also about 12% higher than the stock electronic RZ tach when holding a steady throttle. I took it for a ride with the R1 hacked into place and it responded smooth across the range.
I also tried the HEI mod to drive the tach since I had one kicking around but the bike would start and idle but not take any throttle at all with it in place. I checked the wiring several times and it was as per instructions so I tried it without and it worked fine.
Now I just need to get the right connectors and make the whole thing permanent.
Kudos again to smurph for pioneering this in the first place.
Last edited by RuZty on Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
wonderful info! Thanks Ruz.
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
More math before bed, I measured the rolling radius of my rear tire and multiplied it through the gearing to get 5370 rpm @ 100kph in top gear.
The RZ tach was reading around 5000, while the R1 was reading about 5600. I am assuming that the RZ speedo is fairly accurate, my last conversation with the local constabulary bears that out.
The RZ tach was reading around 5000, while the R1 was reading about 5600. I am assuming that the RZ speedo is fairly accurate, my last conversation with the local constabulary bears that out.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
interesting... most will say that the RZ tach is pretty average at best. tape your phone with GPS digital speed reading on it to the bar perhaps?
80 XT500 Supermoto!
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
I used your suggestion with the phone, tried 2 different apps for GPS speed and found a good one called Pado that also records your track and all motion and elevation change. The stock RZ speedo is reading 2-3% high, which is pretty damn close.
I finished the oil sender;
A standard one is there for comparison as are the contacts, float and tube from the one I gutted.
I tested it mounted in the tank and the light/trip meter comes on with 215cc of oil left, which will get me about 100km. This is close to the level the stock sender turns the standard oil light on at.
I finished the oil sender;
A standard one is there for comparison as are the contacts, float and tube from the one I gutted.
I tested it mounted in the tank and the light/trip meter comes on with 215cc of oil left, which will get me about 100km. This is close to the level the stock sender turns the standard oil light on at.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Thats great news, well done!
The oil sender is genius!
The oil sender is genius!
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Thanks Jon, I am in the fortunate position to spend way too much time on stuff like this.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
haha, yeah these days i seem to have less n less time :/ I should get you to make me one of these, might mean i use my dash sooner lol. In fact maybe make a few and sell em, Ive a bunch of spare senders... ;) :D
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Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
I'm enjoying this read. Crazy good work Russ!
Rory
2 1984 RZ350s
1985 RZ350
9 1986-1990 RZ350s
2000 ST2
2005 749
2005 749 with 999 engine
2 1984 RZ350s
1985 RZ350
9 1986-1990 RZ350s
2000 ST2
2005 749
2005 749 with 999 engine
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
Thanks Rory. I might have a simpler solution, but the parts are backordered.
Re: 2001 R1 Speedometer HOWTO
After waiting 2 months for backordered parts here is the simpler solution;
This is a 'reserve sensor' from a '99-2000 CBR600, part number on the bag. It is 4mm shorter than the one I made which will make the light come on 5-10 km sooner (no biggie). The thread is M18x1.5 and the hole in the RZ oil tank is 20mm ID. Easy solution is to wrap some self vulcanizing rubber tape (electrical splicing tape) around the threads for a tight fit, with a lathe you could get fancier. Bonding an M18 threaded neck on the oil tank would be a slick alternative, and this sensor would work well with a custom oil tank, which I might do on my hybrid.
NOTE: as mentioned previously the R1 speedo puts a resistor in line with this sensor. If you put 12 volts directly across it you will get a puff of smoke in about 10 seconds.
This is a 'reserve sensor' from a '99-2000 CBR600, part number on the bag. It is 4mm shorter than the one I made which will make the light come on 5-10 km sooner (no biggie). The thread is M18x1.5 and the hole in the RZ oil tank is 20mm ID. Easy solution is to wrap some self vulcanizing rubber tape (electrical splicing tape) around the threads for a tight fit, with a lathe you could get fancier. Bonding an M18 threaded neck on the oil tank would be a slick alternative, and this sensor would work well with a custom oil tank, which I might do on my hybrid.
NOTE: as mentioned previously the R1 speedo puts a resistor in line with this sensor. If you put 12 volts directly across it you will get a puff of smoke in about 10 seconds.
Last edited by RuZty on Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.