FUEL

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hotshoe93
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FUEL

#1 Post by hotshoe93 » Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:06 pm

What is the best straight gas to run in a rz350 ? I guess you have to run 10% ethanol ?
84 RZ350 Toomey
2003 FZ1 Yellow/Black
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nokturnal
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Re: FUEL

#2 Post by nokturnal » Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:42 pm

Non-ethanol

I run shell 91
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hotshoe93
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Re: FUEL

#3 Post by hotshoe93 » Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:47 pm

Shell 91 has no ethanol? Get it at any shell stations?
84 RZ350 Toomey
2003 FZ1 Yellow/Black
BULTACO ASTRO
Champion framed Kawasaki F81m
BULTACO SHERP-S Brakeless Dirt tracker
ZUK A-100 w/ FACTORY HOP UP
:smt026

brrrappp
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Re: FUEL

#4 Post by brrrappp » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:20 pm

91 octane is recommended.
It's best if you can avoid the E10/E15 or any alcohol fuels. The alcohol can damage certain types of fuel system hoses, o-rings, and some internal carb parts.
Be aware that if you pre-mix then alcohol fuels are dangerous to your engine. Alcohol attracts water and bonds to the water. Water repels oil. The alcohol + water solution will sit at the bottom of your tank and your engine will be running unlubricated until the alcohol/water solution is used up or your engine is seized up...

Most Marina's have straight gas since boats and watercraft do not like alcohol.

Several small-aircraft airports will sell AV gas to you since this is a popular option with landscapers for lawn equipment. Usually there is 91 octane and 100 low lead. The 91 is actually better for the bike than the 100LL. I think there is something to do with Aircraft engines not being hi-hp and running at altitude, there is less energy content in the 100LL.
In some parts of the country, VP has gas stations that carry non-alcohol street gasoline.
In NH and VT several stations carry non-alcohol gas in the winter for the snowmobile riders.

And if you don't drive 100's of miles and are looking for the best thing possible.....you could buy a barrel of VP unleaded or leaded race gas if you removed the stock USA catalytic pipes.
There are many VP variants.
I've run "VP red" and "VP C-12" (off road of course :smt018 ) because I had a barrel leftover from my MX racing days. Either one is overkill for the stock motor.
But the stuff has a smell that says race gas. Leaded gas is actually illegal for the street. Lead content in your fuel lowers knock (raising the octane number) and also is an anti-scuff lubricant. Leaded gas is bad for your brain, so don't get it all over your hands washing parts or air filters. Also, try to resist snorting it!

The US government is bent on adding Alcohol to fuel. The quantity of non-alcohol gasoline being produced is being reduced by about 60%

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Evans Ward
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Re: FUEL

#5 Post by Evans Ward » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:23 pm

Look at pure-gas.org

I have 93 octane non ethanol available locally that I run in all my bikes and lawn mowers. As expected, it is more expensive.
84 RZ350-Toomeys,SCR milled head, stk 26 carbs,300 M, 35 P, stock regrooved needles AS 2.5 turns out,stk air box,Banshee reeds Zeel non-progr CDI,TSRL Program YPVS,alum rad,R6 shock,GV emulators w/RT springs,fork brace,Shindy steering damper.

Hooligan
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Re: FUEL

#6 Post by Hooligan » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:43 pm

Ethanol is sucky. It will harden up all your fuel hoses etc. I only run the highest octane pump fuel I can find as that will generally have the least amount of ethanol in it.
'82 RD350LC in '81 colours, OEM pipes, UNI filters
'85 FZ750

hotshoe93
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Re: FUEL

#7 Post by hotshoe93 » Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:49 pm

In Ohio if you can find pure gas (ethanol free) which stations are far apart , I think any gasoline that you buy at any station , no matter what the octane has a minimum of 10%.
84 RZ350 Toomey
2003 FZ1 Yellow/Black
BULTACO ASTRO
Champion framed Kawasaki F81m
BULTACO SHERP-S Brakeless Dirt tracker
ZUK A-100 w/ FACTORY HOP UP
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brrrappp
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Re: FUEL

#8 Post by brrrappp » Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:35 am

Hooligan wrote: Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:43 pm I only run the highest octane pump fuel I can find as that will generally have the least amount of ethanol in it.
I'm not sure that's actually correct.
Ethanol is actually an item that the fuel distillers are using to raise the octane level of common use gasoline. Ethanlol or Alcohol has a lower energy output, burns slower and cooler and as a result, suppresses knock. Octane numbers represent a fuels ability to suppress knock. Octane numbers are NOT a reflection of increased power, actually the opposite.
The current authorized standard is 10% alcohol content and Trumps EPA is pushing to allow E10 AND E15 sale year-round. This will decrease the availability of non-alcohol gasoline. Neither E10 or E15 are approved or warrantied for use in small engines like lawnmowers, generators, most off-road motorcycles or most Street motorcycles. Many cars are not even approved for E15. This stuff is NOT on the "diet plan" for classic bikes or cars.

The AMA is against the use of "blender pumps" and the introduction of E15 into the fuel supply.
The idea that cutting fossil fuel use by adding ethanol is fools gold.
The end result is lower fuel mileage requiring more fuel per mile- increases emissions or zero decrease. Additionally, the runoff from fertilizers used in growing this much grain for conversion to fuel is it's own environmental hazard. There is evidence that, thanks to government subsidies, farmers, distillers and transporters are able burn more than a gallon of fuel during the production and distribution of one gallon of ethanol and still make money! The only benefit is a monetary benefit to the farmers and the distillers. There is incredible pressure from the farm lobby and the EPA to continue this practice.

Write to your Congressmen and women against the continued use of ethanol for fuel. We all know it's a bad idea, try to do something about it!

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Questo vecchio rz
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Re: FUEL

#9 Post by Questo vecchio rz » Fri Dec 21, 2018 5:59 am

What they said.. NON Ethanol whenever possible.. if possible? Like mentioned, I'm under the impression in Calif ALL pump gas has a precentage of Ethanol?
Ethanol pump (pump) gas gums up &
cloggs carbs in all my bikes,and all my friends bikes in only 2-3 weeks.
We run race fuel.. in everything. I have to, otherwise I'm spending what lil time & $ ...cleaning carbs. And that just SUCKS! The AV fuel is a option...but I can't find a local airport that will sell it anymore ?.
My Banshee will , NOT run safely on pump fuel it has to run race gas in it,or she will definatley blow up, but the other bikes It's just a precaution to prevent gumming up, as race fuel does not gum up the carbs quicky...so it's well worth $13.00 a gallon as my bikes are not ridden a lot.
Banshee (Baja) race bike,+ 2 A Arms,L.E.Ds, Toomey, +4 stroker IMS tank, run flats.
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seizer
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Re: FUEL

#10 Post by seizer » Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:10 pm

I found a Sunoco distributor a few miles from my house. I can walk in and buy anything from 95 octane unleaded to nitromethane. I’m currently running 100 octane unleaded at 32:1 in my RD400. It’s 10 bucks a gallon.

Bare
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Re: FUEL

#11 Post by Bare » Sat Dec 22, 2018 2:47 pm

In MY part of Canada; Chevron 94 Octane is 100% Ethanol free. Shell premium might be as well.. but Chevron advertises theirs.
I use the 94 exclusively... Because I maintain the Shindaiwas of my Son's small Lawn care business..
A ~dozen 2 strokes... None... of which will run reliably on Ethanol laced gasoline. Interesting that.
Sooo... I simply don't bother testing for similar effects on my Yama.

Semi Oldguy
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Re: FUEL

#12 Post by Semi Oldguy » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:13 pm

I don't have access to non-ethanol gas where I live. You can remove the ethanol from fuel by mixing with water, but it lowers the octane level, I've read about 3-4 points. And you have to be careful not to blow yourself up doing it.

https://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Ethanol-from-Gas

Since I don't put a lot of miles on my 2-strokes I I think it will be worth the effort to save my bikes from the ethanol evil. I will have to add a bit of octane booster once the ethanol is gone.
The addiction:

85 RZ350 Bought it new!
76 GT750 Project
73 H2 Project
75 GT185 Project
03 MG V11 LeMans
90 CB1 It runs
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brrrappp
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Re: FUEL

#13 Post by brrrappp » Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:38 am

The biggest problem in removing ethanol from gasoline is the questionable octane rating after the process is complete. The octane rating is tested and rated based on the fuel composition with ethanol included.
Since ethanol is an octane booster aka:knock suppressor, you can't be sure of what you will have as a real octane level when you follow those directions. In other words, if you buy 91 octane ethanol gas and remove the ethanol what is the octane level? Is it 89 is it 85? is it 79?

You are better off buying non ethanol fuel from a local marina or spending the money for race fuel.


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T.RexRacing
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Re: FUEL

#14 Post by T.RexRacing » Sun Dec 23, 2018 12:07 pm

First of all my RZ is modified. I run VP U4.4 in the RZ. It ain't cheap ('bout $15 a gallon) but the bike is a toy not transportation. Over time the U series has been changed to a much more stable concoction. No more need to drain the float bowls after use to avoid the goo accumulation. R+M/2 is 108.5 and it's oxygenated so some tuning is required. However with that tuning comes a couple ponies. Reliable detonation resistant power. Bonus is I run it in the YZ465 as well.

From the VP site:Designed as a direct, pour-in replacement for pump gas, it will require modest jetting changes, i.e., +2 main jets or +2 pilot jets at most.
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Semi Oldguy
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Re: FUEL

#15 Post by Semi Oldguy » Sun Dec 23, 2018 6:22 pm

If you can be reasonably sure of the octane rating and ethanol content of the fuel you have, you can calculate where your octane rating will be after you remove the ethanol. I would just add a bit more octane booster than needed, for insurance. It shouldn't be any more risky than the chance of blowing your engine from getting a bad tank of gas.

Since my engine won't be built right to the edge of destruction anyway, there will be a bit of a margin of error even if octane is a point or 2 lower than expected.

One problem with running race fuel is that if you don't have the compression to make use of the high octane it will probably hurt performance and efficiency. Not to mention I'm too cheap to pay for it!

I also don't have a marina close by. The nearest is an hour away and only open about half the year. I'm a long way from just about everything.

I'm sure not everybody will think this is a good idea, like anything else. A lot of people do it with good results.
The addiction:

85 RZ350 Bought it new!
76 GT750 Project
73 H2 Project
75 GT185 Project
03 MG V11 LeMans
90 CB1 It runs
12 650GS Runner
87 K75C Should run forever
02 1150GS Used to work

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