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xen-uno
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 350
Location: Davenport, Iowa
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smurph
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Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1652
Location: Cullman, AL
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 Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 4:53 pm
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Why yes... Yes I have. :)
Direct injection has a few obstacles in the world of 2-stroke street bikes. At least more than I want to try and over come any time soon. So I'm going the indirect injection route. More of a bolt on type of thing.
Here are some pics of my latest endevors.
These are the 2 outboard throttle bodies from an R6 properly spaced for the RZ350.
Here is a comparison of the original 26mm RZ carbs vs. the new 38mm injectors.
I must say, these jewels look nice all mocked up. I have a spare frame and this spare engine that I check clearances with. The throttle bodies just can't point straight down into the reed cages, unfortunately.
This is how a 38mm throttle body will work on a stock RZ. It's a neat "velosity valve" that keeps the air velosity constant at any given throttle position. As the volume of air increases, this valve will lift.
And now for something comletely different! xen, do you know what this is? :)
Steve |
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xen-uno
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 350
Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 5:29 pm
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By the glowing eyes and the "I'm gonna git you sucka" stance...I would say it's a cat. What he's about to pounce on looks alot like like an RD500 engine...she's beautiful. Where'd you pick it up at? Very cool on the injection S...
edit: Off the top of you head, how far is Cullman, AL from Raleigh, NC? Curious cuz I may head to NC someday soon and maybe on a weekend, check out your joint. |
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smurph
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Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1652
Location: Cullman, AL
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Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 6:15 pm
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Heh, yeah, that's the "shop supervisor." He's really good at looking at what I'm doing but doing absolutely nothing himself.
I got the 500 engine of off eGay. The jugs that are sitting on it are 350 cylinders. I was just trying them on while the little gears in my head were spinning. :) It could be done, but I think the engine is going back in it's stock configuration for the first go.
I'm about 10 hrs. South of Raleigh. I used to live in Greenville, NC, so I know it will take that long as I've made that drive a bunch of times. :( I don't know... You might be able to make it in 8 if the traffic in Atlanta is not too bad. Probably US-264 east to I-95 south and then to I-20 west to Birmingham and the up I-65 north to Cullman would be the best route.
Steve |
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xen-uno
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 350
Location: Davenport, Iowa
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smurph
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Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1652
Location: Cullman, AL
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Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:11 pm
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| xen-uno wrote: | Hmmm...
RZ350 B&S: 64 x 54
RD500 B&S: 56.4 x 50
Looks like the RZ cyls damn near fit...at least the front bank anyways. Banks look to line up with each other. Do the rods look centered in the bore on the front set? Case induction complicates things for the rear set. 4mm diff in stroke is not much. Are you thinking the same thing I am?
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Yes. Things that make you go hmmm... :) Steve, I think you and I have some serious issues that we might have to deal with in the future! :)
The 350 cylinders can be fitted and centered. One would have to weld some more metal to the mount tabs and redrill the holes. The big end and small end of the 350 rod is the same as the 500, only the 350 rod is 4mm longer. That being the case, one could use 350 rods on the 500 cranks and the piston should go to the top of the 350 cylinders. Then there is the issue of port timing. The shorter stroke of the 500 cranks would retard the 350 cylinders port timing. But the retarded timing is good, as you can raise the ports. (I've never been successful at lowering ports because my die grinder just won't add metal!) Then the next issue is crankcase volume. It would have to be increased. The case induction on the lowers would be blocked off and it's volume possibly be used to increase the crankcase volume of the lower crank. So only the top crankcase would have to be cut on. Works out to 643cc. And then the pipes... what to do about the pipes? Custom from the ground up, I would imagine.
Of course, what would make the thing really easy is if you could shoe horn a set of 54mm stroke cranks into the 500 cases. But there is just not enough material in the crankcase that is available to be removed to fit the 4mm bigger flywheels. And, it would be a very custom crank at that. Not a 350 crank because the 500 cylinders are actually spaced further apart then the 350s!
Although I had fun thinking about the 350 jugs on the 500, I'm going to build this particular 500 engine back stock. After all, it's going to go in my weed eater. Or maybe my leaf blower. Time will tell. :) But who knows how I will build my other RZ500 engine.
Steve |
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S10RZ350
Joined: 08 Aug 2005
Posts: 534
Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:13 pm
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wow...
I love this kind of stuff.. I need a bridgeport and a lathe.. and a home to put it in. lol.
Please continue sharing your projects/ideas.
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1985 KR-RZ350 Project. |
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smurph
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Joined: 06 May 2005
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Location: Cullman, AL
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Posted: Mon May 22, 2006 3:18 pm
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Well... I've completed the fuel supply system on the Throttle bodies. And extended the linkage between the throttle bodies to account for their new wider spacing. I'll put up some pics as soon as I take a few.
Now all I really have left to do is fabricate an external fuel pump tank. It will house the R6 pump unit I snagged. I'm going gravity feed from the main tank to it. The fuel return from the pressure regulator will also be routed to this external tank. I just couldn't stand the thought of cutting big holes in my nice fuel tank.
Then I have to decide on if I want to try this out on my current engine or build up my spare lump which needs rings for sure.
Steve |
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xen-uno
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 350
Location: Davenport, Iowa
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Posted: Mon May 22, 2006 4:28 pm
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| Groovy...anxiously awaiting your ass-dyno results! |
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beebe
Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Posts: 702
Location: san luis obispo, ca
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Posted: Mon May 22, 2006 7:07 pm
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Sweet! The R6 is an in-tank part? Have you checked out in-line car pumps? I've seen some that were pretty small, and that would save some fab time a space??? Then all you'd need is a custom "petcock" that has feed and a return tube.
How do you plan on tuning? Lambda sensor and EGT's?
Looking good. |
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smurph
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Joined: 06 May 2005
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Location: Cullman, AL
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Posted: Mon May 22, 2006 9:10 pm
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| beebe wrote: | Sweet! The R6 is an in-tank part? Have you checked out in-line car pumps? I've seen some that were pretty small, and that would save some fab time a space??? Then all you'd need is a custom "petcock" that has feed and a return tube.
How do you plan on tuning? Lambda sensor and EGT's?
Looking good. |
Yeah, the R6 pump is an in-tank pump. But... When you take a good look at it, it's really just a GM style pump shrouded in a bunch of plastic. The reason I went with it is I knew it was going to be a relativly low amp pump. I didn't want some hulking amp draw external pump like those on some Ford products. And by the looks of the pic on the eGay auction, I thought it was going to be small and compact. You know how pictures can be decieving when there is no reference. But when I got the pump, it was huge! With all of the plastic and all.
Now, this pump is also going in my RZ500 but I have some spare tanks that I can cut up for that project. I also have an R6 tank that will be a donor of sorts for the big ass round hole. But for the RZ350, I will excise the pump from it's surounding plastic and put it in an external tank.
I will leave the RZ petcock on the bike and route the return from the rgulator to the pump's external tank. As long as there is vacuume on the petcock, excess fuel shoul go back into the RZ's tank. Otherwise, it will be a complete recirculating system with just the external tank. So I won't (don't think) need a custom petcock.
I plan on running it rich in the begining with a goal of getting it to start and idle. Then, I have a wide band O2 sensor with controler/meter (DYI O2 sensor project on the net) that I will plug up. I might sacrifice a few O2 sensors, but I'd rather do that instead of pistons.
Steve |
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dirtball
Joined: 07 Oct 2003
Posts: 200
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Posted: Tue May 23, 2006 8:18 am
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Smurph, have you seen "50 projects for the Evil Genius"?
Pretty in-depth book showing how to make your own digital guages and displays. The guy has a whole series apparantly.
On a side note, you don't want to part with that spare 350 head do you?
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smurph
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Location: Cullman, AL
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