Instructor video from COTA ARC class

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RC45
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#16 Post by RC45 » Sat Dec 03, 2016 9:52 am

So its a great commercial for how a full electronic aid S1000 or R1M or CBR-RR with ABS and TC would allow an untidy lazy rider to just go fast without needing to think - then if they ever lose their electronic aids they just go back to tucking the front and losing the back. :)
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#17 Post by pstamper » Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:08 pm

Will watch video. I do need to carry more corner speed. There are a few corners I just cruise around. I am not 100% positive with the front end. I think there is too much oil on the forks. Not using all the travel available and almost no preload. It is still fun.

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#18 Post by pstamper » Mon Dec 05, 2016 9:59 pm

Great video and riding. I wish I was half that fast! I watch you guys race and it is intense. The rear shot off the guy going down was as you said coming in hot on the guy and touched the brakes. Other guy looked like just in a hurry on the first lap. What was the temperature there that day? I should really trust the tires because they will stick. They just announced March for next track day at COTA. I seriously have to be in better shape. That will be good for probably 5 seconds alone.

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#19 Post by RC45 » Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:37 pm

There is also a huuuuuuuuuge difference a track day and a race. In a race you may take risks you would not take at a track day AND the other guy is likely to be far more reckless during a race than during a track day.

I have to ask, was that race in the video a race with a cash money purse? Because the level of intensity and clashing and fairing bumping for non-money race seems pretty stupid.

The cost of damage and injury does not seem to be justified just for a plastic trophy and bragging rights.
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#20 Post by Speed Freak » Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:18 am

No, it`s a pure hobby race with a lap time limit of 2:00 on this track for 1000cc bikes (current track record is somewhere about 1:54). Everyone who is faster gets disqualified to avoid that it gets too professional.
There are also other lower class races called "smart rider cup" with flying start to lower the risks.

What you mention is a problem of the rear starter field.
I think with the modern bikes it`s quite easy to get laptimes to take part in the fastest race, but the success to achieve this goal leads to... how to say it in english... too much self confidence.
I wouldn`t exclude me from this group, sometimes I also came into situations where I tought "is it really worth the risk"?
Most of the time in situations where I can`t pass 200hp bikes in a "clean" way after trying to do so 3 or 4 laps carrying the bike around the corner behind them without a chance to get enough speed to overtake them on the straight...

Anyway, everyone should know whats his personal goal of a trackday and choose the correct event.
The best lap times you get when riding feels relaxing and smooth :smt023
My bikes:
RD500 YPVS 1GE
RD350 YPVS 31K 1985
Honda CBR 1000 RR SC57
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#21 Post by RC45 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:59 am

Yes - it looks like getting out of the early lap carnage is the real trick :)

Having a lap time limit seems like a good idea. Keeps people from just going faster and faster - and its the other guy I am more worried about. If you make a mistake and have a single bike accident that's all your own doing, but when "the other guy" tries too hard and takes people out in the process that is no fun at all.
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YZR500 OW81 Clone
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#22 Post by pstamper » Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:03 am

Well said Speed Freak. I like the idea of practice race. I have seen accidents in club racing and track days. Not like the 70s and 80s with 70 bikes on the track and people being killed on a regular basis. It is always more fun to me trying to stay up with the new bikes whether I do or do not. I like the RideSmart progression and advancement. A suppose fast guy on the street is usually one of the slower and more dangerous guys on the track. I feel if they want to start doing track days the sponsor delegates them on a well prepped 250 or 300 class bike and instructors follows them to see what abilities they have. Most people can never handle the power of the new middle weight class, let alone a liter bike with all the electronics, Traction control, ABS, wheelie control. These are not going to stop you from crashing and should not be used as a crutch if you are a good rider. And then we get into tires, suspension tuning, and brakes. I see guys parked around me that seldom check tire pressure thru the day and then wonder why they low sided. It is all about seat time and being comfortable with the track and your fellow riders. I am already looking forward to March.

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#23 Post by Speed Freak » Tue Dec 06, 2016 12:43 pm

I`m thinking of switching to a 600cc to get faster ;)
In my opinion it`s better to have less power to learn because you are only fast if you have a perfect line.

With 125cc I guess there is somewhere a point where you don`t need to brake if the line is perfect :smt003

By the way... There is another video of this race.
I`m the one in front of the cam bike at the beginning (blue leather and silver bike), he is close behind me during the whole race.
He is a bit faster than me, but was not used to his new bike (brand new ZX10R).
As already mentioned, the lap times were quite bad in this race because I had a low-side crash the day before (slow corner, touched the track with the alternator cover...)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zag3R8d6gWA" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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RD350 YPVS 31K 1985
Honda CBR 1000 RR SC57
Yamaha R1 RN04

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#24 Post by pstamper » Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:17 pm

Was that the one you injured hand or finger at?

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#25 Post by Speed Freak » Tue Dec 06, 2016 1:55 pm

No, this was later, second time this year on this track.
I wish i could forget this year, had 4 crashes.
Ok... one was more falling into the grass at close to 0 speed :smt005
The other 2 were just simple low-sider, one time because of the alternator cover (alternator removed for next year with flat cover, front and rear of the bike lifted up) and one time the front tire decided to die within 15min riding (pressure and temperature was fine, same tire as the whole season and only used 2 days).
Small mistake and I was in the gravel again.
Replaced the tire by the same model (a used one from the paddock) which worked well for the rest of the day and the day after :smt017

Had 5 years on the track without crashes...
Only big change was that I switched from Dunlop to Bridgestone V02.
Next year I will use a Dunlop KR front tire again - expensive but worth the money.
My bikes:
RD500 YPVS 1GE
RD350 YPVS 31K 1985
Honda CBR 1000 RR SC57
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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#26 Post by pstamper » Wed Dec 07, 2016 11:17 am

I still need to take time on write up of the RZ progress. I have had two offs. One was thinking suspension is always fine and combined with being rushed. Rear shock had orifice get plugged which basically closed rebound circuit and caused suspension to pack. I also went out with out not checking tire pressure. All combined, I hit a dip on a reasonably fast corner and bike slid, nasty high side. Both the bike and me were banged up.

Second one was less than two years ago at COTA. Rental bikes on the track and guy on a Triumph Speed Triple ran me off the track in turn 11. I was frustrated and decided to pass on outside getting on back straight and right when I was beside him he moved to the outside. Could of been way worse than it was. He went to hospital with concussion and I home with bruised hand and left leg that got caught between bikes..

Learning experience that you never trust anyone on the track and always expect the unexpected. That was level 1 which is always a mess at COTA. The back straight is so inviting to see how fast your bike will go but they forget that they have to stop it and then turn. Too much parking in the corners. Level 2 advanced is better but you get the Level 3 guys that stay there because they are the fast guys and do not want to be passed. It will always be that way so 2A is where I will be staying.

By the way Pirelli for me and I figure tires are cheap compared to crashing.

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#27 Post by Speed Freak » Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:50 pm

Yes, in lower classes you have to expect everything...
That was also my mistake - I was in the second fastest group in the morning because with the annual pass you have to tell them which group you want to be for all tracks. On the other tracks I`m not that experienced and they need much more power with long straights, so second fastest group is fine.
After lunch break they regrouped according to the lap times and I was in the fastest group - quite happy to have a lot more space now and used it to have some laps with the instructor.
He told me some areas to improve and i wanted to try it.

Focused on trying new lines etc. i forgot that there are slower riders...
But I`m happy with my decission to go into the gravel and not involving him into the accident.
On the racetrack the one coming from behind has to take care of the one in front - basic rule.

Costs of all 4 accidents: 30€ for a left handle bar, 300€ helmet and my Brembo master cylinder is ugly now but still works fine.
Maybe I should also count in my Dainese leather which I have bought used for 200€ (as new...) at the beginning of the season :smt019
Fairing was always repaired by my father who is also repairing glider airplanes out of glass fiber.
Finger healed itself :smt004


Good tires are a good investment, but good riders can also go fast on cheap stuff.
Changed to Bridgestone V02 because a lot of guys are fast with them and happy, but I heard from 2 riders during the season that they had similar experiences with them.
A whole group changed to this tire and in this season a lot of them lost their front end which was never the case before.
They also changed back to Dunlop KR on the front and cheap (190€...) V02 on the rear - not that critical because you can feel the limit before you crash.


I put the R1 into the garage a bit pissed off after the last track day this year, but at the moment the motivation is coming back.
Let`s hope that the next season will be a nice one :smt023
I will reduce it a bit, 12 days were too much for me. 6-8 days and only 2 tracks should be fine next year - and focus on restoring the RD500 :cool:
My bikes:
RD500 YPVS 1GE
RD350 YPVS 31K 1985
Honda CBR 1000 RR SC57
Yamaha R1 RN04

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Re: Instructor video from COTA ARC class

#28 Post by pstamper » Thu Dec 08, 2016 10:57 am

That is a lot of track days. I am spoiled with COTA and probably did 9 days there this year. Did a few private days this year also. Helped some friends at some races also. If back straight 1/4 mile shorter the big bikes would reconsider passing. I am hoping to do all the COTA events next year but hope to have help while there. Usually John with RDs Only Texas helps with set up, putting on warmers and stuff, and packing. That stuff is exhausting in July and August by your self. Going to pull engine out this winter to fix oil leak at transmission and replace the water pump O ring seal that is also causing a small oil leak. Both just enough that I put a sponge against the two spots to keep mist from getting on pipes.

It would hit the lower pipe and run to the silencer.
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