What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

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hailwood1965
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What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#1 Post by hailwood1965 » Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:47 pm

1984 RZ500. 6k Not great condition. Has been sitting on the sidestand since the 1990s. Last run in the 1990s. Kicks over and feels pretty happy on the kicker, not loose, not tight.

Outside of the engine is weathered and varnish-y wherever there was fuel.

Fuel tank interior was not bad. Cleaned it and it's good to go.

Looked in the cylinders and at the pistons after I took the exhausts off. Inside looks pretty ok. Surprisingly. Hooked up a battery and all lights work. I did not hear the servos when I turned on the key like they do on my 350 (?). Oil looked actually pretty good from the engine. Antifreeze was also very green.

My Holiday plan was to jerk the engine and tear into it. Buuuuut this really is stretching my abilities.

Typically is there any way possible that this thing could run and get by with just a top end job? Is there any kind of treatment to fatten up the crank seals without splitting this thing?

Advice and suggestions welcome.
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Speed Freak
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#2 Post by Speed Freak » Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:55 pm

Top end might not be the problem. Depending how long it was sitting all your shaft seals will start to leak. I think the Yamaha crank seals with PTFE sealing lips are not so sensible.
More critical is the waterpump seal.
Static seals like head and cover seals are uncritical, they will not start leaking from not using the bike.

Check the power valves. If they are stuck you have to remove the top end anyway.
If they are ok you can remove the cylinders without removing the heads.
For crank seals you have to split the cases. 2 bolts are hidden below the front cylinders.

Check your fuel tap, the seal often gets brittle, also check your carbs for parts of the seal.

Replace your oil lines.

Also check the swing arm and linkage bearings.
The chaun guard on the swing arm is often worn and then the chain cuts a hole into the sealing cap so that water can enter the bearing.
The collars of the bearings between frame and linkage can break and the plastic bushes are often worn.

Thats basically what I have found on my bike (40000km)
My bikes:
RD500 YPVS 1GE
RD350 YPVS 31K 1985
Honda CBR 1000 RR SC57
Yamaha R1 RN04

silverstrom
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#3 Post by silverstrom » Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:34 pm

If you're going to put the bike on the road take the time to do it properly. There is no cheap or easy way to do it. Tear the engine apart and see what you have. Rebuild it and enjoy it for another 20 years. Ignoring decades of storage and having no idea what is inside the engine can end very badly. It could also lock up the rear wheel and throw you to the asphalt.

Buy a manual. If you can read it you can rebuild the engine.

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busa1300
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#4 Post by busa1300 » Mon Dec 24, 2018 2:05 am

This is what I found on my 6000 mile RZV....still had nice factory hone marks.....and rust :smt013
Ended up pulling cranks even though leak down showed the seals were good.....
After 35 years, you might as well start off fresh.


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silverstrom
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#5 Post by silverstrom » Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:09 am

That's ugly RC45.

That's what happens when someone stores a bike and doesn't plug the exhaust and intakes. Damp air makes its way inside the engine and you get rot. I've spent days trying to split cases because cranks had become solid lumps of rust.

If you don't look, you'll never know.

podman
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#6 Post by podman » Mon Dec 24, 2018 6:33 am

My bike had also sat for a long time with very few miles and I spent a couple of years working thru problems and issues which where only finally sorted with an engine rebuild, gotten away with it on a few 250/350LCs that have been sat for a while but there are no compromises or shortcuts with the 500 it would appear...

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tacky1
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#7 Post by tacky1 » Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:27 pm

I have rebuilt quite a few 500s over the years, The one thing they all had in common was failed crank seals. Every single one of them.... I have my daily rider sitting in the garage with a blown piston from a failed, new crank seal. Its sitting for 9 months now and I haven't looked at it, Kinda pissed off with it and all the work that went into getting it back like new,
Sooo, I would pull the engine, replace the seals and check out the cranks while I was in there, But that's me...
1985 RZv500
1984 RZ500 Hybrid
1986 RG500 Walter Wolf
1986 RG500 Skoal Bandit
1984 RZ350
1984 RZ350 Hybrid
1981 RD350LC
1981 RD350LC Hybrid
2009 CR500AF Supermoto 250X
2007 CR500AF 250X
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MK
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#8 Post by MK » Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:30 pm

I'll second a very high likelihood for crank seal failure after long periods of storage.
The lips have a coating (teflon ?) that seems to loose contact over time when not being in use.

I had that on my bike on the lower right side which drained all the gearbox oil within 20km (accompanied by a giant smelly cloud behind me).
Bye
Martin

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Mike Cichetti
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#9 Post by Mike Cichetti » Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:36 pm

Pulling the engine and splitting the cases is the only way to be sure. Otherwise the chances of a failure and more damage is just too great.
Not simple or easy but necessary.

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Jeff B
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#10 Post by Jeff B » Wed Dec 26, 2018 2:11 pm

You'll want to go through the carbs as well. Make sure the jets are clean. If the float needles and seats don't look brand new, I'd replace them.

hailwood1965
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#11 Post by hailwood1965 » Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:25 am

Thanks.

Best source for carb parts for the RZ500?

silverstrom
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Re: What are the Chances of a top end job being enough?

#12 Post by silverstrom » Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:19 pm

hailwood1965 wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 12:25 am Thanks.

Best source for carb parts for the RZ500?

I find the best source is Yamaha.

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